Bush administration ignored clear warnings

Before this is over Americans will be lucky to have shoes. Along with commercial real estate will come a credit card meltdown followed by massive pension defaults as baby boomers try to enter retirement. GM's pension liability is >1000% it's net worth. America bleeds the equivalent of a GM every few days. Obama's solution: more debt to get us out of debt. Why does this nation follow these Pied Piper's?

Time to end government welfare for government employees. They can pay for their own retirements out of their own paychecks just like the rest of us do in private industry. The government elite, with their lock tight job security, blue ribbon health benefits and anti-socialism, anti-Medicare and other programs for the needy snobbery, while the rest of us pay their freight ends....now. Too bad if they have to do without retirement...Should those the Bush Administration's policies damaged most worry if they can pay enough in federal taxes, property taxes and sales taxes to keep government leeches in financial heaven?

Spread the pain. It's their turn. So much for Republicans who claim small government in the smallest number of hands is the least financially draining. How would they know? They and their lobbyist friends in the banking industry are the biggest extortion artists going.

audie

ummm...proudly bursting your bubble. Paulson and Bernanke with Bush and co. were the ones that told America that more debt is needed to get us out of debt. But then again I do remember when Obama signed the bailout...sitting proudly behind the desk in the oval office, smirking at the world. Obama seemed awfully pale when he was using that platinum pen to sign his beloved bailout.

The Federal Reserve definitely caused the Great Depression by contracting the amount of money in circulation by one-third from 1929 to 1933

Milton Friedman

why break from tradition? the method is different but the spirit is the same, wealth transfer from the have nots to the have so much already

want some sound financial advice, buy some beans and rice. 

What bubble, roadlesstraveled? Americans embraced debt as a way of life shortly after WWII. Each succeeding administration expanded it as they discovered the minions will choose debt over self-responsibility and austerity every time. Americans dodged the bullet first by sending the wives off to work. Another reprieve occured from the sale of worthless bonds. The internet gave us another reprieve. The last shield was the use of homes as ATM's.

Well, then, if we have no shoes (or houses), I'm moving to the beach in Mexico!

I really do not think it is fair to lump "government workers". I am a government worker. I pay for my own retirement...thank you very much! I also pay for my own benefits, etc.

I have also been foreclosed on and I am currently looking to rent and start over. That is all my family and myself can do at this point. We moved from one state to the other and as first time home buyers were taken for a ride. The mortgage company was unwilling to work with us when my husband was diagnosed with Congestive Haert Failure and when he was laid off. Some things are out of people's control and unforeseen. But that doesn't mean we are not good people or that we leech off the system, nor does it makes us stupid.

The current crisis cannot be blamed on any one organization or person or group. It has many mitigating factors and the only prudent thing to do is vote for what you think is right and pull the boot straps up and start over.

I think the bigger issue is the current job market that is drastically declining and what it will do to the people who are currently not in foreclosure, but soon might be.

Maybe it is time to quit being the generous and all-saving neighbor and say no once in a awhile and put some of the hard earned money of the American people back into American for a change. No matter what party is running this country without people to make money and since the possibilty of the majority of those people being baby boomers that are either force or pursaded to take early retirement how will that effect us when that "buy-out" money runs short and we have to bail them out. Or worse have to take on the added expense to take care of their medical and extended care bills.

There appears to be a whole lot more to all of this them the actual focus of the mortgages and banks. But as magicians do they have us watching one hand while the other is double dealing and I do not restrict my comments to just one party. it is both. Maybe what we need is a colon cleanse of higher government (Congress, Executive Branches, Executive Administration - those that dole the funds out) and start over!

I hate to say it, but we're already there. I've seen allusions to commercial foreclosures in several stories, but it's still the elephant on the coffee table that is being willfully ignored. In my area, I've watched three medium sized hotels built, when there isn't enough occupancy to support one. I've also seen untold numbers of strip centers being built, when the existing shopping centers had plenty of empty storefronts. Those who actually have some businesses in them are fairly marginal, like tanning centers and nail salons.

I'm afraid it's going to get a lot worse before it gets any better.

Greg-281912, my comments originate in Hawaii. Sold my house in San Francisco in 2005 for an obscene profit (saw it coming) and dropped out of the rat race. Surf's up!

The debt, even secondary market investment is ok....it is the over leverageing that is the problem.....look at it this way....I sell you a bond for $20.00 and tell you I will pay you $25.00 at maturity....but I sell too many bonds ....so the only way I can pay you back is to develop a ponzi scheme....but the ponzi scheme implods because no one wants to play....but I still have to pay you your principle and interest...And I don't have it....Typically one who commits securities fraud goes to prison but in this case the banks just hold us hostage by refusing to lend and stealng your money by enlisting insiders willing to give (paulson/bush)....So instead of these people and institutions being held accountable.....they are stealing your treasury....and you are letting them because you are ignorant.....SAD!!!!!

Commercial  already moving down , just look at all the empty unit all over.

GONZO-   How do we stop them.....? How?

When I read the amount of people saying NO BAILOUT it still happened...

Bush said here Pals, 350B and there's more where that came from....

Where is the accountability? I mean no questions - No indicments- NOTHING- more than anything, this is when bush lost me.....

But it's the ole pals club here... These's guys take care of one another....

It's just GoZo I feel HELPLESS TO STOP THEM....

Dam .... everytime they play the bail game their only selling treasury notes to foreign countries to raise the billions. But these have to be paid back with interest... Can you imagine the interest on this ....? It's going to be brutal....

I am guessing by now it's no secret that we are not funding this through our own taxes..man... I mean how are we going to pay that foreign budget deficit and all the following

1.current war

2.Social security

3.welfare

4.High treason banker CEO swindle

5.rebuild Iraq and Afganistan

6.unemployment

7.car makers incompetence

8.NAFTA is bring us to our knees

9.Foreign Aid

There comes a time when you realize they are taken care of themselves and this will save nothing but promote even a worse disaster.... man... I think were screwed because we cant stop them from SELLING "USA" down the road....

Its like were HELPLESS TO STOP THEM...

audie, smart thinking!

I'm not much of an island person myself, but I am thinking South American beaches in the very near future. 

The rat race is fast becoming pretty much not worth getting up for anymore.

pensions

You don't need more regulations just smarter ones AND most of all less conflict of interest.. the Federal Reserve is ONE HUGE conflict of interest...

No regulations is how the Bush Administration got us into this mess....2 Bushes....2 Bailouts. You'll notice that those European countries that have the tightest government regulations on banking are also the ones not doing so badly in this horrible economy.

ewent.  This was an issue through Clinton's administration also.  Not just Bush's.  Blame Barney Frank and his cohorts on this, also.  He strong armed the bank's in to giving these mortgages to people that could not afford them.  Look it up on the internet.  You will find the information to back this up.  But, being a liberal you will not want to look. 

ewent    Last year Europes largest bank failed.  So, what are you talking about.  And the Bush administration did not get us into this mess.  Bush signed nothing!!! 

This all goes back to Clinton.  He wanted everyone to have a house.  Did you read the article.  It said people with bad credit.  It was Clinton's administration that put those policies into place, that let those people with bad credit to get into houses. 

You are BOTH wrong.

The Federal Reserve and Politicians in BOTH parties got us into this mess. Don't take the bait that redirects where the blame should be...

Mark,

  I believe you should look at the dates mentioned in the article.  I believe you will find a Republican President and Congress.  The Democrats took over a slight lead in Congress in January of 2007.  I believe both parties are to blame but the buck stops  on the Presidents back.  Your last statement, "But, being a liberal you will not want to look."  is a little one sided don't you think?  Most are going to see this as Americans before they play party puppet.    

Mr. Rogers   George tried to get Nancy & her homies to stop this.  Alan Greenspan told them two years ago to do something.  Heck!  This thing goes all the way to the Supreme Court.  There policies that were put in place by Clinton & the OCC. 

The Dem's will always want to help the poor.  Did it help?  

It is done, placing blame isn't going to do a damn bit of good.  Now we need to get out of the mess and sniping at each other isn't going to do the trick. We better all start getting along because with this kind of economic news we are all going to be in the same boat together. We will end up helping the poor even more because the low paying jobs they are in will be going away and we will be lucky if we keep ours.

The unfortunate fact is that lobbyists have been writing most of the legislation for so long, that our legislators don't know how to regulate or legislate.

I'd be willing to bet that if you asked the average person if there is any difference between accepting lobbying money and accepting a bribe, they would say no. I don't see any difference, particularly when the campaign funding laws in all 50 states say that politicians can donate their war chest to the charity of their choice upon retirement. It doesn't take too much imagination stretching to assume that any given politician's favorite charity is themselves, although the probably have to start a foundation run by their brother-in-law so they can sit on the board and draw a fat check in addition to their government pension.

I can't see that changing any time soon, unless we could suddenly find 6o Senatorial candidates and 261 Congressional candidates who could qualify for the sainthood. None of them is going to propose any legislation that would stop them from making money. The only feasible solution I can see is to vote against the incumbent, every time, for every office. before they get entrenched in Washington and become millionaires at the expense of all others. I don't see too many of these tired old warhorses doing anything that a whole bunch of other people could do just as well. In a nation of 300 something million people, I find it hard to believe that the handful of rat bastards we have in Washington are the best we can find for their jobs.

Actually, I believe that the bush admin has some responsiblity but actual it was under clinton and greenspan that all regulations where loosened almost completely. This was admitted, unbelievably by greenspan when he spoke about his flawed model. And now we have mr change as president and has basically picked a cabinet from clinton admin, what change is that!

Catydid,

Understanding what (or who) got us into this mess is not just about blame.  If you don't understand what causes a problem all you will do is treat the symptoms. 

This entire article is about blame. 

The administration's blind eye to the impending crisis is emblematic of a philosophy that trusted market forces and discounted the need for government intervention in the economy. Its belief ironically has ushered in the most massive government intervention since the 1930s.

If you believe that under-regulation promoted by bankers and the Bush administration caused this, then you will add regulation and assume that all will be well when Bush is gone. 

If you believe, as I do, that this problem was caused by earlier presidents and Congress and regulations that promoted irresponsible lending in the name of "affordable housing" (see Community Reinvestment Act, 1996 changes), you will know that the same people and philosophies that got us into this mess are the ones trying to get us out.

Before and throughout this "crisis", nearly all politicians continued to stress that we cannot do anything that will prevent lenders from providing mortgages to low income borrowers.  This is why the sub-prime market came into existence in the first place.  If you can't make payments on a traditional mortgage, you either don't get a house or you get a sub-prime mortgage.  Why is this so difficult for people to understand or accept?  Does it just feel better to blame Wall Street and Bush? 

The biggest problem with these bailouts isn't the money (my money) being spent, it is the fact that it continues to reinforce the philosophy that the borrowers were innocent, the lenders and brokers and Bush were guilty, and that the all powerful government is going to come in and save people from themselves.

When personal responsibility is gone, personal freedom won't be far behind.

Bush poured gasoline

The four worst financial disasters of the last 100 years have come at the end of Republican administrations that have aggressively promoted deregulation in the financial markets, despite Paulson's claims..

The Great Depression starting in 1929 came during the third consecutive Republican term, the October 1987 stock market crash and the Savings and Loan disaster which saw 747 S&Ls fail surfaced in the second Reagan term and the current financial market disaster in Bush’s second term.

The combined Reagan and Bush terms have rolled up in excess of 80% of the total national debt since 1776 resulting in payments on our national debt equal to our defense budget which is close to half of the total defense budgets in the world - just for perspective.

If Nero fiddled while Rome burned, Bush poured gasoline on a financial disaster extolling the virtues of more of the deregulation that has brought this country to its knees.  He has left us with a broken country and a broken military, with nothing positive to show for, and the conservatives want more and are wondering what went wrong!!!!

The answer is simple.  You can't just give children gasoline and matches and tell them to go outside and play.  They will, and did, burn down the house.  You have to find toys for them to play with other than the national budget.

If they have to have a discussion about what went wrong, they need psychiatric help - along the lines of Alcoholics Anonymous - starting with denial is not a river in Egypt.

And if they give serious consideration to Palin as the next presidential candidate they probably need to be institutionalized as certified before they destroy our country.

Amen!

ewent

That's because they bought our bad notes. Who do you think we were selling them to? Why do you not know were this bailout money is going. One and one does equal two.

Funny how many are spouting off without understanding how the Government really works.

The regulatory arm of the federal Government is part of the Executive branch not the Legislative.

And the move to deregulate was started by Regan.

Not just bankers , lobbyist...

Bankers are the most evil form of lobbyists.

- They ramrodded the Federal Reserve Act onto the American people

- Then they made it incredibly difficult to declare bankruptcy and start over

- Despite public opinion, congress bailsout these same companies without changes in managment, in the some of 1 Trillion+

Mr. Rogers I agree completely these banks made it difficult for the typical civilian to file bankruptcy and that is why we should let these banks go bankrupt?

That leaves no one responsible, to be held and jailed and all assets removed and sold off to put back in the system as it is in some offshore account in Bermuda or something. 

Both Parties are responsible and both need to be held accountible at the ballot.  Vote out every incumbant on both sides.  Or better yet impeach those involved in the House of Finance..

Does anyone know the study results about the psychological profile of a corporation?

A: SOCIOPATH

Giving power to a sociopath, now there's a concept!!

The author is an idiot.  There is no way that Bush should be blamed for all of this.  Yes, partial blame, Cox should get partial blame, but the largest blame is for Rep. Barney Franke.  He is one of our politicians that dictated to the mortgage lenders to let these $500 per week wage earners buy $300,000 houses.  The only way to do this was no money down and loans for purchase price of the house or the appraisal.  Then his idiot constituents voted him in again.  He needs to be held accountable and never will.  It's a shame that these one side editorials put the blame on one person and not all that were involved.  Bush did warn of the meltdown, but I will agree that he did not do enough to avert the problem.  Barney Frank and his cohorts stated many times that there was no issue here and as short as one month before the crap hit the fan.  Let's put all the blame where it is due and not single out one person on this issue.

Just sign right here so Mr. GotRocks of the housing industry can walk away with billions in commissions. No one approves their own loan and they certainly didn't in the past. Who let these sly foxes in the banking henhouse? Bush and Cheney. Who else? The Big Business Big Butts With Badly Warped Brains.

ewent   The Democrats vote those foxes in.  You've got Bend over Barney Franks with his Gay Lover over at Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac, telling everyone "It's gonna be alright pretty soon.  It'll be a GOOD stock to buy."  You've got Chris Dodd, "Chairman of The House Banking Commitee.  And Nancy Peolosi.  My favorite of all.  This woman has used more of you tax payer money for her own personaly gain, that any of them.  She has belly ached at everything George Bush has done.  He'd give a speech to Congress & she'd sit behind him & sneaker.  She's a WITCH.   

The Democrats didn't have control of Congress for 6 years. Did they? Did you imagine that this mess just started 2 years ago? Fantasyland...here you come.

Daughter,

  Read the article and pay attention to the dates.  You had both a Republican President and Republican Congress. 

ewent, you're an idiot, stop posting because you’re showing everyone just how stupid you are.  This all began with the Dems hero Carter, Clinton then put it on steroids.  The Democraps stopped any regulation the repubs tried.  It’s amazing that all this started two years ago, take a look at what they are saying now about the economy being in recession,  let’s see that was after the first year of democraps in total control of the congress.

We all see Obamanomics in full swing already since business is getting ready for his taxation and people are cashing in to pay less in capital gains.   Trickle up is really starting to work.

Defending the president is tiresome he was a boob.  Defending the congress of the last 2 or the last 8 years is just as hypocritical, cant anyone see they are all incompetent partisan politicians who love power and will do anything to obtain it?  The stance that my scoundrel is better than your scoundrel is the thinking that has created the toxic mess we call the government as we know it.  Its not about governing its about pointing your finger and spewing some partisan nonsense.  Is it possible to agree that if the symptoms were ignored 8 or 6 or 4 or 2 years or even 6 months ago that our great political leaders missed the ball and neglected their responsibility?  Or is that too much for you partisan thinkers to admit?  We should hold every one responsible for this disaster to account, I dont give a damn who they are and I don't think we should give anyone a break just because we agree with their politics.  This is after all a really big deal and we wont fix it with inane partisan bickering. But one thing you can be sure of we will all pay for it one way or the other.

Why do articles always funnel you clowns into the blame glame?? Bush, Clinton Reagan, Dems, Reps, who really gives a f@!$%#?? The question is- what do we do now?? How do we get control over our representation?? I dont have the answers but I think ideas as to the future would help more than arguing over whos right about the past. All I know to do is vote out incumbents every time. I agree with ending benefits for these clowns and I think we should have some kind of accountability in our political system, like re-voting for an office when approval rates go below 25%. Just a thought.....

Okay, so the Republicans had absolute control with all 3 branches of government from 2000 to 2006 when the bottom fell out and control of 2 of the 3 branches of government after that.

They had a responsibility to monitor and report and the power to do anything that they wanted to.

So, logically, it was all Barney Frank's fault. 

Didn't your mother tell you that if you are smoking the good stuff that you should share.

"absolute control"???? Learn how our gov works, partner, before sounding silly with phrases like this.

I recall when 90% of American's supported Bush's decision to invade Iraq. Now the nation reaps the consequences of giving him carte blanch. Ya'll know who you are. You have met the enemy and he is youse.

90% of Americans were lied to as to the basis of that invasion into Iraq. Stop trying to rewrite history. Bush is now and always will be a professional liar.

Stop trying to blame others for your poor judgment.

Let's see now...Bush ...and Cheney ...big time educated men...can't balance a budget. When these guys were born with silver spoons in their mouths, they ceased to care where their next meal came from....Poor judgement? You bet.

You bunch of Yahoos!!!  Saddam Hussein was sitting over there with training camps & making Weapons of Mass Destruction.  Saddam would then test them on the Kurds.   He wasn't going to stop with the Kurds or even just one attempt on George Bush's Sr. life.  These Muslim's are never going to stop.  I for one like sleeping in my nice warm SAFE bed at night.  So Yeah!  Don't you remember 9/11???   

And I'll cling to my guns & religion.....just like Obama told me to do.   Ha! 

The Bush Admin knew that Americans were angry after 9/11 and they fed that anger with lies and fear tactics.

Stop trying to defend your boy Bush and his Admin.. I blame Cheney and other puppet masters even more than I blame Bush. GW is just a figurehead. I'm glad I can honestly say I didn't vote for Bush.

I was never for going into Iraq. I wanted Bin Laden to be caught/killed along with  the Taliban/Al Queda terrorists. Iraq had nothing to do with these groups.

Most of the 9/11 attackers were Saudis but the Bush Admin didn't make much of it because they are in bed with the Saudis.

I agree - stop blaming others.  I saw right through Bush's smoke screen on Iraq and I never supported that decision.  I understand folks voting for him the first time, but the second time..?  Really now?!?!

Fool me once shame on you - Fool me twice shame on me!

Stop believing the hype people.  Get involved in your community and your government.  Sending representatives to Washington is not our only responsibility as citizens.  We The People have to hold these folks accountable and not just take it without vaseline!

ewent, what are you babbling about and why are you suddenly so insightful? Bush & Cheney cannot be the first to have fooled you or are you 8?

Saddam was put in check after we whipped him in Desert Storm. he wasn't a serious threat to America. If you believe all the propaganda and fear tactics used to justify going into Iraq, then I have some magic beans to sell you.

There are worse dictators in power all over the world, killing and oppressing more people than Saddam ever did. You don't see the Bush Admin rushing to help them out. Maybe because they don't have resources our corporate barons and bankers really want or need.

It all comes down to money and profits when going to war. The contractors and suppliers have made billions of $$$ and the Bush Admin is/was in bed with them(Haliburton is a prime example)

We are all tired of the blame game. You want to talk about Crimes, look at the Clinton Chronicles, look at the Clinton Body Count.

http://www.zpub.com/un/un-bc-body.html

As an Ex-cop/Investigator now there are some real crimes.

But let's forget about that, because both sides are crooks. What are we going to do now to fix this economic crisis? It's going to take both sides.

American Lobo     I just don't agree with you.  I know a little more about the WMD"S over there than you do.  But, the ONE THING that Bush did do, is to put a barrier between Israel & Iran.  I wished long time ago that Iran & Iraq would have inialated each other.  The CIA almost succeeded.

Any way.....we are way off point. 

Besides, it's only my opinion. 

Daughterrevwar,

I'm quite impressed with your first hand knowledge of Saddams weapons of mass destruction.  But i am in awe of your grasp of proper spelling when articulating your opinions.

Hate to spoil the blame party, but the one and only culprit is greedy Americans who bought McMansions on a Shack budget, now we all have to pay.

And I, for one, am not happy about it.

DaughterRevWar

You bunch of Yahoos!!!  Saddam Hussein was sitting over there with training camps & making Weapons of Mass Destruction.  Saddam would then test them on the Kurds.   He wasn't going to stop with the Kurds or even just one attempt on George Bush's Sr. life.  These Muslim's are never going to stop.  I for one like sleeping in my nice warm SAFE bed at night.  So Yeah!  Don't you remember 9/11???   

And I'll cling to my guns & religion.....just like Obama told me to do.   Ha! 

It is our fault, we got the poor challenged woman so upset with TRUTH she doesn't even know what she was supposed to be writing about. I wonder if she was watching Sarah the bimbette on TV and just went so foolish, she forgot what she was trying to say.

The reason that the article left out the bit about community activist is because that is a myth. It is not true...so it was not included.

Try actually reading the "Community Revitalization Act" itself.

The act of 'redlining' was banks refusing to loan money to people who lived in certain districts, also known as blockbusting. The CRA was to end this process, it did nothing to lower credit standards for loans.

Because bad-mouthing the community activists would be politically incorrect.  Then the government would be accused of pandering to the wealthy and ignoring the downtrodden.  Well, why are we surprised when people who have very little or no income cannot pay their mortgage?  The banks lied and falsified information on loan agreements to make owning the American dream possible for everyone.  It has now turned into the American nightmare.

Oh yeah....Regulators with soft bleeding hearts like Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac? Check out these regulators salaries. Their pathological greed, not bleeding heart liberalism with money is why those loans were made.

And, if the Bush Administration hadn't divided the US into rich and poor and obliterated the middle class, the class warfare of the "Haves vs. the HaveNevers" would be the excuse of the rich now who are trying to abscond with accountability. Rich Regulators who had an eye on more riches. Boo Hoo.

ewent    I missed that event.  Where did the rich move to?  I want to go!!! 

You talk about Feddie & Fannie.  Did you not know that the CEO gave $350, thousand to Obama for his campaign.  Ran those two into the ground.  Then went to work for Goldman Sachs & gave Obama $700, thousand more for his campaign.  Then the guy ran that into the ground.

l 

Daughter,

  Well I was wondering when you would change the subject and start blaming Obama.  The article is very clear on the dates and guess who was in charge of both the Congress and the White House?  Is it that hard for you to admit what everyone else already knows? 

Another prime example of the liberal press distorting and misrepresenting the facts and trying to blame Bush.  You never saw in the "news" that Fannie Mae's prior CEO was a major player in the Obama campaign.  The mainstream media has about as much credibility as the National Enquirer, Weekly World News and other supermarket tabloids.

The CRA was a big part of this trouble...both dems and repubs kept it going...and both parties chose to ignore the trouble brewing...time to hunker down...at this point it doesn't matter who the next pres is...we all need to take care of ourselves and our families...become as fiscally responsible as possible....the heck with all the politicos...

To nkorb1

This is a rediculos argument.  Look as the statistics on the home forclosures.  I've read that a full 66% of the foreclosures in the last 11 months are for documented loans.  Those are loans where income was verified and the amounts fell within the BANKS guidelines for loan origination.  The "CRA" did not require no doc closings or indeed closings that were outside the normal perameters of the banks that wrote them.  That Act was only intended to encourage people to stay in urban areas and thus avoid the "flight" to the suburbs that wreck cities and infrastructure.  Just drive through a few high end neighborhoods or look on line and see the huge volume of homes in default.  Most people in this country are just one medical emergency or one temporary loss of a job away from foreclosure.  Perhaps you  are as well and have been lucky!  And about the Dems being 'in charge', I don't know about you but most everyone I know did very well in the 90's.  JOBS and regulations are the answer!  Hope you know what the question is!

Here we go again!

It's his fault!

No, it's his fault!

No, it's their fault!

No, it's their fault!

It's the blame game son, you'll learn it someday!

Fault is not something that should EVER be ignored. It's also a synonym for another word that used to mean a person with honor understood..."accountability". People who make stupid decisions ARE at fault. Who else? It's only when the buck stops no where and the big mouth know it alls feast at the table of grand denial that the blame game is played.

to becky in atlanta...

re:documented loans...the problem is that many of those loans were "qualified" based on income to debt ratio...and payments that were so low because of ARMs...and as the equity built (before the bust)...many were doing a re-fi and using that $$$ for lots of "stuff"...so as the debt went up and the income stayed the same or went down...

too many buyers and realtors took the Scarlett O'Hara mind set.."Ill worry about it tomorrow..."

well...tomorrow is here....

ewent has a good & valid point.  Fault is something to be learn from  That is why Obama wants to get some of those people back into his fiancail tean that helped cause this.  Larry Summers was with Clinton & helped write up this mess.  Obama said he believed that Mr. Summers could help us out of this.  I thougt that was really brave of Obama to bring him back.

Daughter,

 Wrong again but keep trying. You mentioned Clinton then jumped to Obama but you keep leaving out the main player.  I'll give you a hint, he is still our President.

ewent, it is important to name names and when the truth is told I believe a lot of people will be looking pretty sheepish.  This from my research was a truly bipartisan effort. 

I am trying to comprehend were the last 8 years went.  I see a lot of blame going to Clinton, but the past 8 years haven't been in a bubble, there is plenty of blame to go around.  There are politicians from both sides of the aisle that are complicit in this fiasco.  You can trace the problems all the way back to Reagan who started increasing the deficit with his trickle down theory, that didn't work,  Bush 1 got stuck with that mess and was forced to raise taxes.  Clinton was fortunate to have the Internet bubble to buy some time but he also is complicit in stripping regulations to open the markets even further.  bush2 is equally guilty he took deregulation to its next level.  the current problem would have exploded eventually it just happened on George W's watch but he had 8 years to try and fix it if he thought there was problems with the system.  Congress has been a corrupt den of leeches sucking the lobbyist cows milk dry, since well before the so called 94 contract with America that ushered in a republican majority, and they became as corrupt as the previous congresses. 

 Lets say for a min. that all you say is true. Why then did President Bush not change all this when he got into office? I mean is has been eight years. I could understand if it took him a few years to get it straight but it should have been done in the first let say three years of his first term. No there are crooks on both sides and enough blame to go around. I still think President Bush has the worst track record of our time. I will be glad to see him go and only hope that Mr. Obama will prove himself a different kind of President. One can only hope.

You have misrepresented the CRA program.  If you check the Federal Reserve studies, up through their last survey of CRA banks in 2002, the CRA loans were suffering minimal losses for those approved banks that followed traditional underwriting guidelines. 

The CRA loans were not subprime loans.  Do a little research on the subject and you will come to the conclusion that it is a Republican propaganda piece to deflect responsiblity for their gross mismanagement to the minorities community.

luvenia48

by no means was i justifying the presidency of George W.  i would put his presidency as one of the worst in the history of the united states.

The CRA was established under Pres Carter (D).  This act was associated with the equal opportunity act and others in the late 70's because there really WAS racial discrimination carrying over from the 50's and 60's.    It was also a result of the review of race riots, including Watts, that highlighted the problem of unfair lending standards that made it harder for minorities and certain neighborhoods to qualify for home and business loans.

The CRA stayed pretty much low key, pressure was brought to bear on lenders to "rethink" their lending criteria and an unpublished, but well known, quota system was sort of in use.  So many loans had to be to minorities, that sort of thing.  These loans were packaged pretty much as any standard loan, and though the purchasers financial criteria might be less stringent, things were structured to ensure that the loan would be affordable and would be paid off.

In the 90's, we had a resurgence in racial awareness due to the Rodney King verdict and subsequent riots.  It was noted that black neighborhoods had more liquor stores than grocery stores, that they were generally blighted and filled with gangs dealing drugs openly.  (I agree, this is a broad racist characterization, but in general those were the observations.)

An argument was made that an ownership society would help fight these problems.  If more minorities owned their neighborhoods they would have more pride in both the appearance and local culture.  Eventually halting the dispair, blight and drugs. 

A noble idea.

In the 90's, under President Clinton (D), the CRA was given steriods as the CRA was used to target lending institutions (banks, mortgage companies, car dealers, credit card companies, etc).  Accusations were  made that these institutions would "red-line" entire communities or neighborhoods, denying credit or making the terms required to acquire credit too strenuous.  Like a modern-day Poll Tax.

Now, all should understand, Presidents aren't responsible for day-to-day oversight of these various acts.  Congress is, that's why they're called "Acts of Congress".  A President can push and pressure for policies but Congress does most of the actual work, not the President.  Presidnets can make declarations all they want, but Congress has the power to implement, ignore, drown out or censure the President.

One of the fundamental problems in Congress is what contractors would call "scope-creep".  What is started as a fairly narrow description of duties slowly expands to become almost all encompassing.  Even worse, individual Congressional scumbags have a goal to expand personal power, fame and influence.  All of which combine to help keep them in office to further expand personal power, fame and influence. 

Unlike a private contactor, this scope-creep has no hard cost to the individual Congressional Scumbag, the larger the scope, the more power, fame and influence. 

The House Subcommittee on Financial Institutions and Consumer Credit (I'll shorten that to HSFICC) have been chaired by a Republican for quite a while, no challenging that.  However, when the committee has a majority of members of a different party, one of two things happens...absolutely nothing, or a majority rule.  The HSFICC has had VERY strident members of the democrat pursuasion that have capitalized on the theory that lax regulations meant more homes for more of their constituants (no matter what the cost nor what the efffects may truely be  to their constituants).  Prominant black representatives blocked efforts to tighten regulations with an innuendo that such policies resulted from having more home ownership allowed for minorities and becuase Raines was black.

WITH ALL THAT SAID...the real root of the financial problem goes back even further and, I don't believe, has nothing to do with race.  The REAL root is that Congress created an independent entity in 1913 known today as the Federal Reserve. 

The Federal Reserve has the power to make independent decisions and take independent actions with no accountability or financial oversight from the President or Congress.  The Fed encourages borrowing by dropping the reserve rate for member banks, then tightening borrowing by raising the reserve rate.

This sounds good in theory, but what happens is that the Fed creates what is now known as a business cycle.  Inflation raises prices due to increased borrowing that makes cash plentiful, supply drops, demand increases.  Tight credit makes cash scarce, supply increases, demand drops.  Tight credit means there is a period where member banks (member banks are all banks in the United States) repossess assets and file proceedings against debtors to recover losses.

The banks then start selling the assets and refinancing them.  This time, though, the Fed has been irratic.  The reserve rate was tightened to much, too soon, and the result was that relatively new mortgage products and packaging had interest hikes that put payment beyond the means of borrowers of every stripe that had one of the "innovative" loans.

Fierce determination to deny or reduce effective regulation, due to it's perception as racially motivated, created a subharmonic wave that resulted in a devasting earthquake of collapsing fortunes and homes.  The members of HSFICC that bitterly fought these regulations were democrats and, generally, black representatives.

What they didn't even begin to think about was how predatory and deceptive many of these loans truely were; not only to minorities, but to a large segment of the general population. 

Congress works with all the speed of geologic processes.  Only now are they beginning to gibber about how terrible the situation is and who to blame for it.  The blame is not external, the blame lies with Congress. 

Every single one of the members of HSFICC for the last ten years should be drug out onto the street, horsewhipped and shot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs&feature=related

You start out with some interesting history, but then you distort things, and ignore any aspect other than the mortgages!  In 2005, the biggest investment banks asked the SEC to let them stop carrying reserves, so they had more money to  invest.  The SEC said "okey-dokey", and when things went bust there were no reserves to fall back on.  Also, this article clearly enumerates the warnings and head in the sand attitude caused by an ideology of deregulation.  Paulson still will not attach conditions to bailouts.  That is why the banks will use the $250 billion not to make loans, but to pay dividends ($125B) and buy competitors.  In England they were wise enough to attach conditions.

This is really just a replay of the S&L failures and bailouts under Reagan.  Deregulation always, always leads to failures and bailouts.  That is why moral hazard is so big a deal, these guys know they will get a handout. 

The mortgages were highly leveraged (50 or 60 to 1, or even more).  That means that, even if the mortgage is paid off in full, there is still 50 times as much paper out there, not backed by anything.  This turned into a huge pyramid scheme, and the only way to keep it going was to keep making mortgages.  At that point, it no longer mattered whether the mortgages were good or bad, they just had to exist to prop things up.  Bound to fail, like all pyramid schemes.

Only solution is sound government and regulations.  That is the responsibility of both parties.  Unfortunately, the Republicans tend to be the party of deregulation, so when they have power, they create this chaos.  The Democrats have become very shy about trying to regulate, since this bogeyman is always trotted out.  They both need to accept their responsiblities to the people.

Ignorance is not bliss..........model for every administration to live by.

You're reading an article from MSNBC that is so left-leaning it was "in the tank" for Obama from day one. Do some research on your own you koolaid drinker. Look who was on the committies that were supposed to oversee the banks and wall street. Start with fat Barnery Frank, Democrat who was , beginning in 2007 and did NOTHING when this started unwraveling. As far back as 2004, there is video of him opposing regulation of Freddie Mack-Fannie Mae. Where are they now?

Read about the "Community Revitalization Act" that  above points to in his comment. Then read about Chris Dodd,  Democrat Senator and Chairman of the Senate Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs who was taking sweetheart loan deals directly from the CEO of Countrywide Home Loans. Where is Countrywide now?

So before you start spewing the same old "blame it on Bush" vomit, get informed.

Which wouldn't be so bad if 90% of the rest of the world didn't also agree that Bush is a failure. Nice that we get such a dumb slug for a president so the rest of the planet can laugh at us.

PerryJ - i read your comment - you mentioned quite a few people but deliberately left of GW or are you saying that he is completely innocent in this financial mess we are in - that he had no idea what was going on - hmmm

Hey fools.....the headline is obviously slanted as is the reporting, (thats a generous description of the writing.).....The TRUTH???? ahhhhh........ well... how about Barney (puke) Frank and Christopher Dodd, elite senators, in 2005, telling a republican/administration backed senate inquiry of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac that  "The republicans were fear mongering" and"No indication of any problems in the mortgage market was immenent" hence no action taken!!!!!!
   Now I read this tripe....All prominent Democratic congresspeople were pushing, threatening and cajoling the banking industry to lend money!!! including the 2 incompetent crooks mentioned above as well as Pelosi,Obama, et al........Liberal democrats are ruining this country! Wake f*&^(* up!

You obviously missed Bush's Texification of US law these past 8 years. In Texas, you get to rip off thousands of people's retirements and the CIA will jimmy up a death certificate and change your identity and Texas will expunge your record of theft, extortion and wipe the slate clean.

Enronitis ...It was good enough for Texas...So, Bush figures why not the rest of the country?

 Look at the dates. 

ewent    You think Ken Lay is alive???  If you know his where abouts.....you could make a million bucks.

Some of us did see it, Anniek. I sold my home in San Francisco in 2005 when it was evident to me a bust was imminent. I relocated, bought another house paid in full, shed all debt, and put a wad of cash in the bank.

I have travelled and worked all over the world since the mid 80's and have always been stuck by how grand America lives compared to most of the rest of the world. It was harder to get a credit card in Germany than a mortgage in America. The Japanese have $5 trillion in savings at 0.5% interest. Something seemed unnatural to me. Now I know it was all a house of cards. How exactly can this nation undo $10+ trillion in debt, demise of a manufacturing economy for a shell game services one, and dependence on foreign oil that drains from the U.S. an amount equivalent to the value of GM every few days? How the entitlement mentality, the current denial, and 30+ years of living beyond our means, or the impending catastrophe from baby boomers entering retirement and discovering social security is a Ponzi scheme just like real estate, or pension plans that will go bust be undone? WHERE IS THE MONEY SUPPOSED TO COME FROM? Like most parties, suddenly this one is over too.

Oh and let's not forget the banks. It seems they may have just a little responsibility in not managing their loan portfolios properly and in giving loans to people who shouldn't be getting them to begin with. Not to mention products such as Interest Only mortgages. Does anybody see anything wrong with that??

Bush and his administration are of course clueless or blissfully ignorant. He has run this country just like his failed business ventures. For those bloggers who babble on about liberals and the liberal press...you're just tired and sad.

I think the bumper sticker says it best: Drunken frat boy runs country into ditch.

audie,

You are right and I wish I had the answers, All I know is that as I see it the government will have to cut a lot of programs and stop spending to pay down the debit. It's going to take a long time to do that but until we do thing will only get worse. You can't expect people with out jobs to pay taxes, I think we are all going to learn some hard thing in life. Like I said I owe very little and thank god for that I pray I have everything paid off very quickly I have money put back and for almost a year have not bought anything I did not need I mean really needed. I just hope before things get worse I have the time to pay off and put back enough. God bless the people with big bills. I think the government is going to have to cut programs that will hurt people and the People of the USA will have to help each other. Maybe it time people don't expect the government to pay for them from birth to grave. I am happy you did what you did for your family and your self. God bless

Only one word is needed: DEBT.

FINALLY !!!! Someone with knowledge to know what really happened.

Thanks T.J.-749401  I totally agree with you!!

Well said by an obvious homophobic, neo-fascist Republicrite.

Sorry, folks, but the blame lies with greedy Americans who wanted McMansions and Hummers.  Nobody held a gun to anyone's head and made them sign those mortgages.

Barney Frank! 

Its a great idea to put homosexual pedophile satanists in high positions of the congress.  They will do whatever they are told.

I wonder who holds the photos of the congressmen with little asian boys?

Thats right two guys in the minority party overrode an entire Republican government to cause the problem.

Hey brain dead Republicans -- read the dates in the article. Does the year 2005 ring any bells? Yup

Republican President, Republican Senate, Republican Congress and head in the sand, just like with Katrina and 9-11. Yup blame it on Barney and Chris -- they were in power at that time

A senator in the minority and a congressman in the minority scared those big Republicans with the awesome power of

BEING DEMOCRATS!!!

Wise up guys -- The Ostrich Adminisatration has 50 days to go -- I hope we can survive it

Paul - Since you are prone to being so well-read and indignant, do your homework and see that YES - the DEMs had the votes (not the majority, but the votes) to procedurally BLOCK the legislation to tighten controls.

Your bluster does NOT change the facts.

When was Barney Frank president? I must have missed that.

Blaming only one person is pretty ignorant. No one person had that much power and control. We should blame the Bush Admin., the banks/lenders, and consumers equally.

People need to stop trying to live way beyond their means and quit buying expensive crap. A lot of us Americans keep buying, just to keep up with our neighbors or so we can say we have the newest fad or tech before our peers.

Nope, Congress isn't at fault.

Greedy Americans, living beyond their means, is the issue.

Cite your source, when / where did the administration try to stop this mess?

I say International Bankers, and the Illumized (or Satanized) Masonic brotherhood. 

But it sure doesn't help that Americans are soooooooo stupid.

LOOK its Britney Spears!!!!!

Where Where??

I agree that lots of greedy people living beyond their means caused a lot of this mess, but We cannot dismiss the fact that our elected officials should be held accountable too. After all they were elected to govern For the People, not overlook regulation that will harm the People.

ScubaDev,

pay attention to the timeline....the concerns were brought before the committes and the exec branch in 2005. Frank and Dodd were minority members of their respective committees and were definitely not in control of things. Republican congress and Republican president implementing Republican policies have brought on this disaster. Certainly some democrats pushed for relaxing credit rules, too, but to blame democrats for this mess is mere right-wing partisan spin.

put your bong down, Jim.......

Jim Hayes..well said

and that is the GW Bush Administration in a nutshell.

And I say - keep that baby going - we're going to need it!  I read these posts to get some idea of what rank and file Americans are truly thinking and come away more disheartened and sick each time. Seriously, the hatred spewed under aegis of "discourse" is nauseating.

George Walker Bush and his Merry Band of Thieves have ignored every fact and warning, except those it cherry-picked to fabricate Bush's private little "War on Terror" in Iraq. The whole bunch deserves to be tried, convicted, and imprisoned for treasonous acts against the American people. Clinton fudged about oral sex because his wife was in earshot and he found himself impeached! Bush & Company are walking scott-free and they've bankrupted this country financially, ethically, and morally! It doesn't make any sense to me. Maybe we should waterboard them so they can explain to us how it isn't torture.

It is time for Barney Frank to answer some hard questions. He is the top congressional elected official with direct oversight of Fannie and Freddie. Let's demand that he answer to us!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you....The experts always say it best. Sr. Management is another two words for No Accountability. Add to that greed and fat salaries. The only real joy in any of this is watching ignorant senior management squirm.

The democrats headed off legislation that would held many of these companies accountable - the democrats are not the sweet savior everyone believes they are. The democrats profitted from most of this! 2005 - please go back and see what Franks had to say when the Republicans and Bush attempted to head this off. Franks said 'No Worries' and let the legislation die. Where is Franks now?!! If you want to send someone to jail - send Franks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPSDnGMzIdo

cnnbradley,

in 2005, democrats were minority in both houses of congress. republicans were in control, not democrats...republicans are attempting to pass the buck on this, but are not going to get away with it. you cannot re-write history.

Larry,

You're not a bright man.  Nobody is attempting to re-write anything.  I'm lucky in that I'm an independent that is able to see what you don't have the brains to see.  BOTH PARTIES are at fault here.  4 years of subprime lending under a Dem President and Rep Congress, 2 years under a Rep Presindent and Rep Congress,  6 years under a Rep President and Dem Congress.  But, it's people like you and your naivity that allow this kind of governance from either party.  CONGRESS has the PRIMARY responsibility, not the Executive Branch, of oversight into domestic matters.  Your Dems (for whom you would vote no matter what their views) ignored subprime as much as the Reps.  Why?  Poor people (who had no business getting loans at all) were able to buy homes.  A good Dem like yourself would certainly not be foolish to come out against poor people securing loans (they could not afford) and being able to own a home.  So Pelosi and Obama (who I voted for as an independent) and all your other favorites were either ignorant of what was occuring OR they were simply holding their breath and hoping everything would turn out okay.  Those are the facts and nobody is trying to "re-write" anything.  So which was it: the ignorance or the breath holding?       

Eric,

Subprime lending is all about deregulation and the stripping away of 40+ years of consumer protection. Clinton bears some responsibility for not vetoing legislation but his economic team were generally in favor of deregulation. The government never forced anyone to make a subprime loan the institutions and the greed of the brokers along with individuals financial naievte along with a healthy dose of greed led to this problem. The canard that Fannie or Freddie were forced to make bad loans is untrue at  best legislation allowed them to and the % of bad loans among lower income groups is no higher than any other group. Allowing banks, brokerages and insurance companies to all join the game was the problem. Selling a risky vehicle bundling it and using it as an asset to issue bonds or borrow capital is deceptive accounting which skewed balance sheets until the bubble burst , it may take a generation or two to completely sort this mess out.

JKHayes

Eric,

the fraudulent loan practices, such as overblown appraisals and failure to verify income have been illegal for many years. I re-fied some properties in 2004 and the loan docs included signature blocks signed by me and the loan officer that all information was true and accurate. overstating income and overblown appraisals were a common practice. these were illegal activities and subject to prosecution. law enforcement is the responsibility of the executive branch. unfortunately we had an idiot for a president and an incompetent justice department, who were applying their Republican philosophy that government is bad, and the less regulation of business, the better.

I would agree that democrats share some of the blame, however, from 2001 to 2007 the Republicans controlled the white house and congress. to try to blame democrats for this mess is laughable.

The Frank and Pelosi pact set us this road:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122091796187012529.html

The failed socialist housing program. Their philosophy that all should be able get into a house even though the people are trying to buy a $400,000.00 house on a $32,000.00 salary - doomed from the start - Thanks!

Bobby - I assume you think Warren Buffett is a pretty smart guy since he supported your candidate for president. Right?

He said that Paulsen is the one of the smartest men in America and absolutely the best man for this job.

It is easy to cast stones my friend.

Rational,

Bobby is a party man who would cast stones at anyone who does not VOTE like him.  I say "VOTE" and not think.  Because there is little thought that goes into the staunch support of only one political party with no consideration for any other point of view.  If Bobby were capable of it, he'd probably consider the fact that Henry Paulsen is an expert on economics (as Mr. Buffett pointed out) and not an expert public speaker (like Bobby's soon to be President elect).  If Bobby were an actual thinker at all he'd know that there are those who offer nothing of substance but can speak so eloquently as to sway the masses (like Bobby) and there are those who are extremely intelligent and experts in their fields of endeavor who have had no formal training in public speaking and are nervous in front of cameras.  I guess that's Bobby's criteria for someone in Paulsen's position:  someone who made an A+ in speech class. 

Believe it or not, banks used to be REQUIRED to use accounting methods to determine if a loan was a risk or not.  Having worked in the banking business I have seen the GREED up close.

Then the "boys" started to look around and see that some were making money by not having to follow the regulations for banks so ----- the banks lobbied for the "same playing field" and of course got it. 

Let's face it, greed pushed this at every level.  I am an independent voter and we have had our share of good and bad presidents in both parties.  Unfortunately Mr. Bush was not one of the good ones.

Read the book Shrub.  It was written before GW ran for president.  His history of failures should have been a warning.  Personally, I think he was used by the far right to push their adgenda.  

We as a people have to put petty politics aside and admit when our President (no matter which party) has not done a good job.

America first, party second.

NICE POST.  Someone who gets it.  It's not about political parties anymore or should not be.  BOTH parties sold us up the river and ignored subprime lending.  At the same time, we as a society allowed our representatives to sit on their hands and do nothing about it.  WE went to banks and asked for loans with payments we could NOT AFFORD.  Simple math would have showed us we were wrong.  WE sat behind desks and offered the loans because our bosses told us to do so.  WE allowed our banks, insured and backed by our Government and our money, to sell interest in bad loans to foreign investors.  We're as much to blame as our government or anyone else.  But, I'm willing to bet that most will continue to sit back and allow themselves to be LED instead of REPRESENTED by their government.  Keep blaming everyone and everything but yourselves, SHEEP.   

You are spot on!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are we so partisan as to not be able to see the truth when it is so well documented? It is easy to cast stones. Do a little digging and understand who failed us.

Why isn't Barney Frank being require to answer in hearings right now?

Nice shot. But Barney and Nancy didn't have control of Congress for 6 years, didn't balk at every common sense suggestion from their opposition and didn't make war instead of unity. The Republicans did that along with a lot of other scandalous things. It took trillions of dollars of money wasted on the military industrial complex Bush and Cheney profited most from and will when they leave office. It took Bush pumping billions into big business like he did in 2001 when he handed billions to corporations so they'd hire new employees. Guess what? They took that handout and unemployment rose, not fell every year after.

Stuffing their money with taxpayer revenue is what Bushes all do best. It helps pay off a political campaign that he couldn't have won any other way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPSDnGMzIdo